1959 Splitty turn signal, brake, running lights

[Amskeptic]

Thanks for all the encouraging words. Last night as I fell asleep I realized i never fully explained why I mentioned that the body shop did the windows instead of Sewfine.
Basically I had 2 vent windows, a Sigla on the drivers side and a Sekurit on the passenger side when it went in, when I got it back the Sigla was on the passenger side with the logo on the inside. Reading backwards from the outside! They were confused by the fact that I had 2 passenger side vent windows.
So they had a 50/50 chance of putting back correctly and they failed, much like when they put the rear view windows on the wrong sides... One is taller (passenger) and one is shorter.
Anyway I cannot slide the driver's side window a mm. Not sure what to do about that. They broke 3 of the pop outs when installing them because, I found out later, they did not remove the tac from the window rubber and it caused the windows to break I guess from the minute extra coating causing a fitting issue. I demanded they take off the labor charge.
Unfortunately they were 3 pristine Sigla windows and they are rare as hens teeth in that condition. I have been able to replace 2 of them with Sekurit for the time being.

I figured the rest of the mechanical issues would be easy enough to figure out on my own so that is why i took it back when i did. I was told the paint issues were fixed, unfortunately they weren't but they are around the belly pans and jack points so they should be.

My present conundrum is the turn signals and the fact that my brake lights only work if the lights aren't on. I am going to go back over the screw holes for the lights and remove the paint to allow a better ground and possibly get a new flasher relay. Hopefully that will fix the last electrical gremlin.

Are you up on the flasher relay wiring? It is complex.

The turn signal/brake lamp bulb filaments (21W) are absolutely independent of the running lights filaments (5W). You have bulbs installed incorectly somewhere. The turn signals *do* interact with the brake lights, however. They are designed to allow a flash when the brakes are on. That means the turn signal has to "overpower" the brake light. The turn signal flasher relay makes this happen.
Colin

[James Dwan]

Are you up on the flasher relay wiring? It is complex.

The turn signal/brake lamp bulb filaments (21W) are absolutely independent of the running lights filaments (5W). You have bulbs installed incorectly somewhere. The turn signals *do* interact with the brake lights, however. They are designed to allow a flash when the brakes are on. That means the turn signal has to "overpower" the brake light. The turn signal flasher relay makes this happen.
Colin

Nope, not up on the relay. do you mean I have the bulbs twisted to make the contact with the wrong filament???

[Hippie]

It's not supposed to fit in the socket backwards.
Wiring to the sockets is more easily switched.

[James Dwan]

I think the flasher relay is the culprit. It's the original one from at least 1970 or earlier and I have no idea if it ever worked.
I spent a few leisurely hours listening to early 60's music, helps when working on older vehicles I swear, and realized that I have the wires connected correctly up front, after I fixed a ground issue, but the lights are solid when I move the turn signal lever to one position or the other-not flashing.
I also think I have the correct wire going to the bulb in the bulb in the speedo. The lights in the back do not react when I turn on the switch though. There are only 2 wires going to them and they are connected correctly because the running lights and brake lights work. I think I need a new 6v flasher relay Whaddya think?

[Amskeptic]

I think the flasher relay is the culprit. It's the original one from at least 1970 or earlier and I have no idea if it ever worked.
I spent a few leisurely hours listening to early 60's music, helps when working on older vehicles I swear, and realized that I have the wires connected correctly up front, after I fixed a ground issue, but the lights are solid when I move the turn signal lever to one position or the other-not flashing.
I also think I have the correct wire going to the bulb in the bulb in the speedo. The lights in the back do not react when I turn on the switch though. There are only 2 wires going to them and they are connected correctly because the running lights and brake lights work. I think I need a new 6v flasher relay Whaddya think?

Are both running lights properly dim? Are both brake lights properly bright? Do the brake light wires actually come from the flasher relay? If so, yes, a new flasher relay may be in your future.
Colin

[James Dwan]

Actually I can't tell but one of the turn signals seems brighter than the other but I know for a fact that one of the running lights in the rear seems to be brighter, as if one is on brake light and one is on running. Much like the head lights
I need to switch a wire on the head lights one of these days but so far it's a daytime driver

[Amskeptic]

Actually I can't tell but one of the turn signals seems brighter than the other but I know for a fact that one of the running lights in the rear seems to be brighter, as if one is on brake light and one is on running. Much like the head lights
I need to switch a wire on the head lights one of these days but so far it's a daytime driver

I ask these questions for you to connect some dots in your brain.

The flasher relay depends on the amperage draw of the circuit to heat its make-or-break contact. If you have the wrong filament like a wimpy 5W filament instead of the correct 21W on the circuit, it will not heat up correctly. With your recent harness installation, I would get the wiring/bulbs squared away before assuming that the relay is actually bad. A spare, however, is a good thing.
Colin

[James Dwan]

I had no idea there were different filaments for these bulbs. I just asked for 6v. Guess I need to take them out and check. I imagine the info I need is on the bulb socket? Wiring makes my brain hurt so any help is appreciated

[Hippie]

Borrowed from MGAguru.com

[James Dwan]

The light bulbs and sockets are constructed in such a way that the bulb will only fit in one way. So I guess it's possible one of the 2 wires on the rear light bulb socket is on the wrong terminal? The front turn signals only have one wire going to those and ground with the vehicle.

I am using a new wiring harness from Wiring Works with different colored wires than the originals and a wiring diagram I printed off of the Dramba. My head hurts!

I'll try switching the rear wires again. I switched both of them already but maybe only one needs switching???

Also there are no terminal numbers on the flasher relay. Only "K" and "S" and a 3rd with nothing at all. the other is a ground.
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The black wire is on "K" which comes from the switch, the blue/green wire is on "S" which goes to a bulb in the speedometer, and the black & white wire goes to fuse #2.