stuck- need flow chart

[dingo]

'75 Westy F.I. 2L : started fine this morning, then ran for about 3 blocks before dying suddenly and quietly. Coasted in for a landing and would not restart. No murmur of combustion whatsoever.

so heres a perfect oppurtunity for creating a flow-chart.

Battery.12.4 OK. Voltage at coil+ ia about 12.0. Measured Temp2 sensor at 1690 (hot day).

where to next. ? How do i check fuel-pump ? (it is not audible from driver seat, but then it never was when engine ran)

spark ? what is the one-man test for spark ?

dingo

i realized how futile it is to read the manuals on side of the road on hot day ! i need charts, graphics...not pages of introduction.

[spiffy]

where to next. ? How do i check fuel-pump ? (it is not audible from driver seat, but then it never was when engine ran)

Unscrew your double relay from the firewall and pull out your voltmeter and turn it upside down and the check to see if you are getting 12 volts at on each of the testing sequences named in the bentley. You can also check it at the pump by pulling the two wire boots off of the pupm and turning the key and seeing if it is getting 12V down there. A method to just get a simple check is to pop your afm cover and while the ignition is on, gently push the afm wiper CW to make contact.....at that point you the noise that you SHOULD be hearing from the pump will go away. I would say do a fuel pressure test but if you can;t get it started...that wouldn't help. No flow chart but I hope this helps.

[covelo]

I'm still at work, but let me know if you need a hand. I could get out there by 8 or so.

[dingo]

OK. Ignition on, AFM door pushed open, i can hear relay click on. Ran a wire from fuel pump terminal and it measured 10.2 V when relay clicks on.

Then i ran a wire straight from Batt+ to fuel pump...but it did not buzz or whirr or whine (that i could tell).

Then my dad finally arrived. Checked for spark and it was OK. Hooked up his handy-dandy multimeter and the fuel pump reads 8.65 Amps...but still not making any noise that i could tell.

On my dad's suggestion, i rocked the Bus side to side and kept cranking..it finally started. I took off happily, but it spluttered and died two blocks later.

im guessing some sort of fuel clog or pump that is undecided.
my dad guesses that my fuel guage is wrong and that im simply out of gas. if thats the case, he will have a good old laugh.

Thanks for the troubleshooting tips. Ive actually learned a few things so far.

[dingo]

In desperation, i gave the fuel pump a few light smacks with a hammer...and it eventually came to life...buzzing!! I coaxed the Bus home.
Sun going down. Tommorow replace pump.
Over and out.

*Thanks to Covelo and JBerger for calling with advice/support.

Dingo

[Amskeptic]

I'll get working on some trouble-shooting charts, but will be starting with basics and working my way up to F.I.

The ECU apparently slips into an electronic coma when the voltage slips below about 10 volts. You can have a decent reading at rest and the starter pulls the battery down, keep that in mind. A well-charged battery is a good thing to have at the beginning of any diagnosis event.
Colin

[spiffy]

Isn't there a ford pump (don't shoot) out there that has similar flow characteristics? I remember someone using one but I can't remember what model the part was from......I think the guy said it was around $50-$60......That would be worth the $$$ just to keep as a spare

[dingo]

yeah, it seems as if any pump from an L-jet system should work, although that might be naive thinking. Im still wondering why most L-jet vehicles have in-tank pumps in addition to the main pump (my dad's Volvos for instance) whereas the Bay/Vanaagon get away with only one pump. Is it a puller or a pusher ? i have much to learn

[DurocShark]

yeah, it seems as if any pump from an L-jet system should work, although that might be naive thinking. Im still wondering why most L-jet vehicles have in-tank pumps in addition to the main pump (my dad's Volvos for instance) whereas the Bay/Vanaagon get away with only one pump. Is it a puller or a pusher ? i have much to learn

Because the external ones push, not pull. So for that long run from the tank to the engine the pump needs the extra boost from the in-tank pump.

My Volvo is the same way.

[covelo]

That's interesting. My Squareback only has one pump and a long way from the front mounted tank to the rear mounted engine to cover.

Colin is right about the minimum voltage needed. Two weeks ago I went to start the square after it sat for almost two months and it wouldn't start. I switched the "dead" battery with the one in the bus and both vehicles started on the first try. However, I would think that you would not be likely to experience the slow dying that Dingo had once you get an FI bus with a marginal battery going. At that point the alternator should keep it going, shouldn't it?

[dingo]

I think those D-jet pumps (Squareback) are a diffferent design...runs on higher PSI, no ?

I definately had a wonky fuel pump..but possibly it wasnt helped by my old starter drawing too much current.

Since i was getting dirty today, i replaced the starter and it spun twice as fast as the old gal i had in there before..that old thing must have sucked up all the juice during start-up..sheeeesh!

Q: the contacts on the starter terminal were also heavily rusted (coastal fog)..now that they are shiny can i put that dielectric grease on there to keep the moisture at bay ?

[Amskeptic]

I think those D-jet pumps (Squareback) are a diffferent design...runs on higher PSI, no ?
can i put that dielectric grease on there to keep the moisture at bay ?

D-jets can run lower pressure without that vacuum controlled fuel pressure regulator because the fuel load measurement is coming from a vacuum location. Airflow injection reads above the throttle plate, so it has to reduce fuel pressure at high vacuum.

Diaelectric grease is good.
Colin