Paul Ryan For Vice-President

[rallybug]

I pray that we are a pleasant surprise here. Where are you from?
Colin

England

[JLT]

Everyone wants us all to come together as a people to work together, it's pretty damn hard to do when half the folks call the other half names because we disagree.

This from a guy who, in just the previous paragraph, called Barack Obama "an idiot."

The phrase "Be the change you want to see in the world" seems particularly apt here.

[pj]

JLT, that's pretty catchy of you. Did you ever use that same phrase back when President Bush was in office or is that just reserved for us that disagree with Mr. Obama? I don't ever remember you or anyone else on this forum singing this tune when Mr. Bush was in office.

[JLT]

JLT, that's pretty catchy of you. Did you ever use that same phrase back when President Bush was in office or is that just reserved for us that disagree with Mr. Obama?

Gee, I don't know. It's been around since 2002 (it's from Arun Gandhi, summing up his grandfather's philosophy). What on earth does the phrase have to do with who happens to be in office?

I don't use it for everybody, just the kind of person who calls people idiots on the one hand and then, two paragraphs later, deplores people who call people names just because they disagree with him. If you think it applies to you, that's a good thing, because it indicates that you recognize that your own attitude requires changing before intelligent dialog can proceed. If you don't think it applies to you, then this discussion is doomed from the start.

For the record, I'm not calling you an idiot. In fact, I think you're a pretty sharp guy at times. But you're a little too quick to disparage people who don't agree with you.

I don't ever remember you or anyone else on this forum singing this tune when Mr. Bush was in office.

Which "tune" do you refer to? Please clarify.

[Bleyseng]

The tick is that the more folks actually talk to each other, the quicker that grand canyon becomes a trickle of shared resource in a supportive community.


neal

hmmm, the more I talk to the "Right" the more I see the Grand Canyon as a growing abyss. I cannot fathom some of their views or logic esp. their new party platform!
"Republicans emphatically approved a toughly worded party platform at their national convention Tuesday that would ban all abortions and gay marriages, reshape Medicare into a voucher-like program and cut taxes to energize the economy and create jobs."

WTF!

[ruckman101]

The tick is that the more folks actually talk to each other, the quicker that grand canyon becomes a trickle of shared resource in a supportive community.


neal

hmmm, the more I talk to the "Right" the more I see the Grand Canyon as a growing abyss. I cannot fathom some of their views or logic esp. their new party platform!
"Republicans emphatically approved a toughly worded party platform at their national convention Tuesday that would ban all abortions and gay marriages, reshape Medicare into a voucher-like program and cut taxes to energize the economy and create jobs."

WTF!

It is difficult. The catch phrases are difficult to set aside, as they tend to inflame. It's a dance I admit I am far from adept at, but I'm working on it.


neal

[TrollFromDownBelow]

Whoa. ... as my buddy Tony would say "Pump those brakes." Some of this discourse is getting more personal, rather than the intellectual back and fourth that I am used to reading in this forum.

Which makes me wonder, as I've heard others wonder before, has the age of instant information, news, and search made us stupider, or more intelligent? Personally, I think it may be neither. But what it has done is take the process of mulling over new ideas, digesting new theories, etc, down to a sound bite process. We develop a stand (stance?) on something and search out that which reinforces our stand/stance....and face it most people like to be told and confirmed they are right.

Cheers,
Mike

[ruckman101]

Lazier? Goodby critical thought, hello cut and paste.

Troll hit a lot of truth on that one.


neal

[Amskeptic]

has the age of instant information, news, and search made us stupider, or more intelligent?

Intelligenter.
Colin

[RussellK]

The tick is that the more folks actually talk to each other, the quicker that grand canyon becomes a trickle of shared resource in a supportive community.


neal

hmmm, the more I talk to the "Right" the more I see the Grand Canyon as a growing abyss. I cannot fathom some of their views or logic esp. their new party platform!
"Republicans emphatically approved a toughly worded party platform at their national convention Tuesday that would ban all abortions and gay marriages, reshape Medicare into a voucher-like program and cut taxes to energize the economy and create jobs."

WTF!

It is difficult. The catch phrases are difficult to set aside, as they tend to inflame. It's a dance I admit I am far from adept at, but I'm working on it.


neal

How about Christie's declaration Obama wants to dismantle the best healthcare system in the world. WTF? Or the conversation I just had with a Romney supporter who was pissed at Obama because gas has gone up. I asked what should Obama do. Price controls he said. Really? I asked if he thought congress would be on board? He said they are on his side and he still does nothing. I asked what he thought Romney would do. He didn't know what but stated Romney would have done something. I'm sorry folks there is no crossing this abyss.

[rallybug]

How about Christie's declaration we have the best healthcare system in the world. WTF? Or the conversation I just had with a Romney supporter who was pissed at Obama because gas has gone up. I asked what should Obama do. Price controls he said. Really? I asked if he thought congress would be on board? He said they are on his side and he still does nothing. I asked what he thought Romney would do. He didn't know what but stated Romney would have done something. I'm sorry folks there is no crossing this abyss.

I wouldn't necessarily disagree with Chris Christie's affirmation that the US has the best healthcare system in the world - I would just qualify it with the "if you can afford it" addition.

Having spend the first nearly 40 years of my life under the single-payer NHS in the UK, I know it's pluses and minuses. Having just had three wisdom teeth out under general anaesthetic that involved a trip to the OMS dentist's other office for a CT scan a few days after the consult, I can't imagine that happening on the NHS within anywhere close to that timescale.

On the other hand, once I got to the CT scan in the UK, it would've been free and not $300. Like I said, pluses and minuses.

Another example:

My dad had an epileptic fit (his first ever Grand Mal seizure) last summer and I called the ambulance which arrived within 5 minutes, and he was taken to hospital. Various tests were run, he was kept in for a few days for observations, and had an appointment with a neuro. No charge for any of that and his prescription was free too, I think, as he's over 65 (and epilepsy medication is free for everyone, anyway, IIRC).

I'm not sure how much, say, an Eisenhower Republican or an FDR Democrat would recognize either party today.

[JLT]

I'm not sure how much, say, an Eisenhower Republican or an FDR Democrat would recognize either party today.

Agreed. Even those saints of the Republican Party, Barry Goldwater and Ronald Reagan, would be considered far too liberal for today's GOP. (In fact, Reagan actually was an FDR Democrat.)

[RussellK]

rallybug I went back and corrected what Christie had said but you read and quoted the original. Nontheless your "If you can afford it" is spot on.

[glasseye]

I'm sorry folks there is no crossing this abyss.

Agreed. One side refuses to listen and the other side refuses to speak.

What do we call it when people get together to converse?

"Socializing".

[ruckman101]

Watch out for those catch phrases Glasseye, socializing, I mean the root word there is a wedge phrase for some.

The party platforms are clearly polar opposites, especially along the social (dang, there's that loaded word again) issues.


neal