Penn State - Joe Paterno

[RussellK]

Has anyone been following this story? There were Penn State students upset he isn't finishing the season, never mind he ignored his responsibility as a professional and human being to protect an innocent child. I love sports. I do. But dammit why do sports seem to cloud our judgement so much.

[yondermtn]

Disgusting.

The story isn't finished yet. It's going to get far far worse.

[Lanval]

What's sad is that Joe Paterno is probably pretty much who he has represented himself as; someone who believes in integrity, etc. His actions here aren't really all that bad ~ they were indirect, and he probably didn't really know much about what was going on.

He's going to be crucified, though, and for the simple reason that given what he did know, he should've done more. He didn't and it was likely due to his role in a larger corporate enterprise, which normalizes some values, at the expense of others; the protection of his relationship with Mr. Sandusky, of the role of the football program, and the school itself.

Hannah Arendt's book Eichmann in Jerusalem is an excellent discussion of how a system can 'normalize' evil, and while hers isn't the final word on the NAZI rational and functioning, her claim that ordinary people will do bad things if the system is set up to justify it seems beyond reproach.

It is sad to see Mr. Paterno end his career this way, but he ought to have taken that opportunity to act more decisively, and his failure to do so is what he's being punished for.

Michael L

[Gypsie]

This is a very sad series of events.

Very high emotions, Lots of possibles. Shifted baseline of "acceptable" or even "tolerable" and at least 8 lives forever altered by abuse of power.

This will get deep I'm sure. As sure as we will likely not ever get the full picture. Not sure I need to know, either.

Though I'm glued to it in that 'car wreck on the side of the road' way.

[Sylvester]

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke

[poptop tom]

State Penn.

[RussellK]

I think he deserves jail time. So do his assistants and anyone else that had knowledge that something wrong was going on. I wonder if the victims had been the offspring of wealthy patrons if Penn State would have handled it differently. Probably. Paterno's hands look pretty dirty to me.

[Amskeptic]

I think he deserves jail time. So do his assistants and anyone else that had knowledge that something wrong was going on. I wonder if the victims had been the offspring of wealthy patrons if Penn State would have handled it differently. Probably. Paterno's hands look pretty dirty to me.

I was in a similar predicament way back in 1980 as a 21 year-old who reported an incident to the ownership/management at a "certain summer camp somewhere" and was accosted for "disloyalty" and "how can you say such things? how dare you accuse someone who has such seniority? we thought you were his friend! the victims probably were making it up, you know how kids are ..." etc.

I was the person those kids trusted to tell. I rode out their emotions with them, (making it up? no way, not that pain, good grief). After being stonewalled by the administration (and if any guest of said summer camp should read this, take note), I took things into my own hands. Wrote the offender at his home address and told him that though I may not have had enough seniority within the organization to prevail, if he set foot in this country next summer I was going to sacrifice my career at the place I loved to make sure he answered to those kids.

He did not return the next year. I had tattletale remorse, and some angry reactions about how I had dragged a good man down.

But he did return two years later. That is when I instituted my own "safety program" at that place, where I got to nicely warn the incoming staff that all hell would be theirs if they acted out any inner loose ends, and that I was all ears for those kids. I did after-lights-out skits for each group that had them laughing their heads off, but the underlying seriousness was understood.

The two kids who made me aware, spoke with me over the ensuing years about their confusion and difficulties. They are a part of my furies to this day against the polished and indispensible "leaders" who are just a little too damn perfect.

This situation at Penn State hurts deeply in many ways on many levels.
That poor ten year-old had to compose himself and go home with that secret filthy awareness of someone's basest instinctual attack, who deigned to guide/mentor him at up at the phony surface, and lurch through the rest of his childhood marked within.

That poor stupid Mike McQueary had to *witness* that sordid horror and try to communicate it to his "superiors" who clearly blew him off, that is an awful load for his psyche too, almost a survivor guilt, what sort of calculus do you make?

That Joe Paterno's curriculum vitae gets blown up not by what he did, but by what he did not do. I have my own "Joe Paterno" figure who I admire forever, and it really is difficult to blow up the damn house when the whole family gets exploded with it, I understand that wan hopeful hope to just sweep the C4 under the rug. I have seen it close up. Perhaps we all have a calculus of what we will face and what we choose not to face?

It is all tragic and sad and awful and I don't have the energy over here in my universe to look for blame. I am glad, very glad, that there is a conversation going on in this country and in the media about child abuse. It has got to be a great good scary relief for a child to be believed.

May God have mercy on your soul, Sandusky, but be prepared for quite a difficult time now that you have been dragged down by the truth. May you now discover what the truth feels like.
Colin

[skin daddio]

what are the chances the admin knew, and tried to shitcan joepa halfway on because of that they knew about the d and special teams. odds are sparks fly upward.

[Amskeptic]

what are the chances the admin knew, and tried to shitcan joepa halfway on because of that they knew about the d and special teams. odds are sparks fly upward.

Is this armchair speculation? What are you basing this on? Let's say 41%. OK now what?
Tried to "shitcan", thought about "shitcan"ning, what? The d and special teams? Sparks fly upwards from which source? I'm just confused and irritable.
Colin

[skin daddio]

totally arm chair speculation. i speculate there's a better than fifty percent sandusky was word in administration before the early 00's. i suspect they wanted to fire joe the moment the the team lost traction, get new coaches in there, loose sandusky, change the defense and its mystique before it blows in their face. the story is one giant liability to this gang of halfwits. in other words its all known at the top and they must have seen the whole accident coming for years and years. nobody in admin appears surprised; in fact it looks like an i told you so situation.

[Velokid1]

Most of my disgust is reserved for the pedophile and rapist himself, but i also find Paterno's failure to do the right thing very disturbing and selfish and heartless. BUT I have to say, the people I am more troubled by, the thing I find even more pathetic than Paterno, are the fans who have rushed blindly to Paterno's defense for nothing more than an obsessive love for a fecking football program. A sport, for godsake! That... Is a sickness.

[Amskeptic]

the people I am more troubled by, the thing I find even more pathetic than Paterno, are the fans who have rushed blindly to Paterno's defense for nothing more than an obsessive love for a fecking football program. A sport, for godsake! That... Is a sickness.

It is the ignition spark of Mob engineering.
Colin

[RussellK]

I was in a similar predicament way back in 1980 as a 21 year-old who reported an incident to the ownership/management at a "certain summer camp somewhere" and was accosted for "disloyalty" and "how can you say such things? how dare you accuse someone who has such seniority? we thought you were his friend! the victims probably were making it up, you know how kids are ..." etc.

I've been involved with youth programs for a lot of years with coaching and scouting and what you experienced is something that resides on the minds of many who are involved in youth programs. That uncorroborated accusation. Who wants to be the person that turns in another, one who might be a neighbor, friend, or someone you respected a great deal. That accusation has the potential of ruining a person, it's a heady responsibility and I don't think anyone could take it lightly. I've had adults tell me that its what kept them away from volunteering around youth. I've never had to deal with an accusation but in my state the decision to report has already been made by law. Mandatory reporting laws vary in statute state to state but in essence they say if you are involved with youth and have any kind of suspicion of abuse you are legally required to report it to law enforcement. No judgement calls - you just report. Had that been in effect in 1980 your experience may have had a different outcome. What's different about the Penn State case is there is a credible eyewitness who didn't follow through with law enforcement and a body of people who chose to ignore what he reported seeing. How do you ignore the rape of a 10 year old? How do these people live with themselves?

[Amskeptic]

Had (mandatory reporting laws) been in effect in 1980 your experience may have had a different outcome.

I am glad there were not mandatory reporting laws thirty three years ago. I would have *chosen* not to report the incidents and assumed a legal risk to myself.

I did make sure to the best of my ability that no such incidents would occur there in the future. I loved that place. My vaccine was to empower the kids with how to stop anything, and how to communicate it to those who would take them seriously. Then I shared the exact information with all the staff members so that everybody was on the same page ...

How do you ignore the rape of a 10 year old?

I would have likely gone berserk on that bastard.
Colin