Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

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Amskeptic
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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Amskeptic » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:36 am

Latest post of the previous page:

drober23 wrote:
Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:11 am
Here is the (admittedly) stupid question: Could he just replace all the lifters and squeeze a little more out of this setup?

Yes, but there is a risk of metallurgical failure between new lifters and worn camshaft. That can shed metal shards into the oil.
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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Bleyseng » Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:56 am

If he had a set of those ceramic lifters he could just install them worry free. Sorry, sold my set years ago....
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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Ronin10 » Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:19 am

First I've ever heard of ceramic lifters. Were these a one-off thing?
Oscar: 1976 Sage Green Bus, Stock Motor, Solid Lifters, Manual Transaxle

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:15 am

Ronin10 wrote:
Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:19 am
First I've ever heard of ceramic lifters. Were these a one-off thing?
I heard Jake Raby mention them when he was having so much difficulty with replacement lifters going bad. Bleyseng, how do ceramic lifters play with various camshaft hardnesses?
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 80,070 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Jivermo » Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:19 pm

Yes, this is interesting.

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by sgkent » Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:00 am

re ceramic lifters:
Postby SonnyJames » Thu Jan 28, 2010 1:39 pm

Dealt with one that exploded in a Jersey skiff....the carnage was unreal! the ceramic embedded into and destroyed everything. "sand grenade" is the perfect analogy.
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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by tommu » Wed Aug 16, 2017 9:02 am

sgkent wrote:
Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:00 am
re ceramic lifters:
Postby SonnyJames » Thu Jan 28, 2010 1:39 pm

Dealt with one that exploded in a Jersey skiff....the carnage was unreal! the ceramic embedded into and destroyed everything. "sand grenade" is the perfect analogy.
Most things that explode will cause a problem. Any experience of them in a T4 engine with stock spring pressure?

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by tewa3240 » Wed Aug 16, 2017 3:20 pm

the ceramic lifters were Schubeck brand back in the day, were $600+ for eight?
the valve seats & valves will time out before the fancy lifters ever fail, so, for the price,
what have you really bought ? Guess one would need a 'ceramic camshaft lobe' to make it to the next level. : (

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Bleyseng » Wed Aug 16, 2017 8:54 pm

They worked fine with stock cams resulting in zero wear. I paid $400 for a set of 8 for a planned Autocross motor that never happened. Jake called me one day to talk me into selling them to a 914 racer for his engine Jake was building. They were super light and great for rpms in the 7000-8000 range
Geoff
77 Sage Green Westy- CS 2.0L-160,000 miles
70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Amskeptic » Wed Aug 16, 2017 8:59 pm

Bleyseng wrote:
Wed Aug 16, 2017 8:54 pm
They worked fine with stock cams resulting in zero wear. I paid $400 for a set of 8 for a planned Autocross motor that never happened. Jake called me one day to talk me into selling them to a 914 racer for his engine Jake was building. They were super light and great for rpms in the 7000-8000 range

Do we have a true long-term test?
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 80,070 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Washington

Post by Bleyseng » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:54 am

Last I heard guys have been running them for 10 years without problems but I don't know definitely with scientific testing. The way I understand it that the two different materials don't wear due to the oil film sticking to the ceramic lifter surface. They were super light so reduced the valvetrain weight to allow greater rpms without going to super HD valve springs to keep the lifters following the cam (valve float). I remember they stopped making them as the ceramic material became " Strategic" after 911. I was going to build a engine using them along with Nikasil cylinders for a lifetime engine.
Geoff
77 Sage Green Westy- CS 2.0L-160,000 miles
70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

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