Oil strainer bits

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Amskeptic
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Re: Oil strainer bits

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:15 pm

tewa3240 wrote:
Sat Sep 23, 2017 11:30 am
that strainer is holding sgt. kent's drilling shards & the overlay from the camshaft bearings.
non-issue(s). Type IV camshaft bearings 'flake' it's what they do. : (
Have you had experiences with the aluminum camshaft bearings vs the tri-layered babbit bearings?
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Amskeptic
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Re: Oil strainer bits

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:28 pm

Bleyseng wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 8:27 pm
"What we have here with the zinc-fortified oil brigade is the same misattributions that lead people to synthetic oils as a "cure" for hot oil temps that should not be so hot in the first place. We have had some real problems with metallurgy in the lifters and camshaft lobes, that is the issue, not the composition of the oil."

This comment flies in the face of real scientific testing vs seat of the pants gosh O'golly it works for me.
Flies in the face? Really? My comment that lifter and cam metallurgy has been a problem "flies in the face of real scientific testing"?
I'd like to research this further.
Do you have links that show zinc-fortified oil users have had no problems with cam/lifter failure?

You would like to paint my comment as pants gosh O'golly it works for me, but you miss an important point.
I have not made any recommendation to prevent cam/lifter failure.
You have.
You recommended zinc-fortified oil because the seat of your pants gosh O'golly sez it works to prevent lifter failure.

Robbie, a person with experience and growing knowledge, offered that he did suffer lifter failure with zinc-fortified oil.
I offered that I have not suffered lifter failure and I have never run zinc-fortified oil.

So, reconsider the science, the control variables, the data, and allow me to reiterate that I think the problem with lifters and cams have been metallurgical or installation error perhaps, not the composition of the oil.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

tewa3240
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Re: Oil strainer bits

Post by tewa3240 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 11:45 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:15 pm
tewa3240 wrote:
Sat Sep 23, 2017 11:30 am
that strainer is holding sgt. kent's drilling shards & the overlay from the camshaft bearings.
non-issue(s). Type IV camshaft bearings 'flake' it's what they do. : (
Have you had experiences with the aluminum camshaft bearings vs the tri-layered babbit bearings?
Colin
The units I saw tearing down 2.0 chasing cores, all had Kolbenschmidt camshaft bearings, all flake like partial jig saw puzzles
& camshaft journals were still good but the classic 'divot' was on every lobe. This is mid -ninties junkyard engines. people
would scrap 13-15 year old vanagons without blinking an eye, usually they all had a one burnt exhaust valve, & off to scrap they went.
The KS were the 'trimetal' you refer to? They all had steel backing, an intermediate layer untouched by damage, then the 'crazing' on
the working surface.

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Bleyseng
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Re: Oil strainer bits

Post by Bleyseng » Mon Sep 25, 2017 11:49 am

Amskeptic wrote:
Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:28 pm
Bleyseng wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 8:27 pm
"What we have here with the zinc-fortified oil brigade is the same misattributions that lead people to synthetic oils as a "cure" for hot oil temps that should not be so hot in the first place. We have had some real problems with metallurgy in the lifters and camshaft lobes, that is the issue, not the composition of the oil."

This comment flies in the face of real scientific testing vs seat of the pants gosh O'golly it works for me.
Flies in the face? Really? My comment that lifter and cam metallurgy has been a problem "flies in the face of real scientific testing"?
I'd like to research this further.
Do you have links that show zinc-fortified oil users have had no problems with cam/lifter failure?

You would like to paint my comment as pants gosh O'golly it works for me, but you miss an important point.
I have not made any recommendation to prevent cam/lifter failure.
You have.
You recommended zinc-fortified oil because the seat of your pants gosh O'golly sez it works to prevent lifter failure.

Robbie, a person with experience and growing knowledge, offered that he did suffer lifter failure with zinc-fortified oil.
I offered that I have not suffered lifter failure and I have never run zinc-fortified oil.

So, reconsider the science, the control variables, the data, and allow me to reiterate that I think the problem with lifters and cams have been metallurgical or installation error perhaps, not the composition of the oil.
Colin
In 2000-2001 there was a bad batch of camshaft blanks, so yes there was a time where that was a real problem. This was sorted out by JR who did his famous "spintron" testing of numerous cams and lifters. JR also did his RoadAmerica real world testing of a bunch of oils along with L&N with oil analysis for determining the wear of cams/lifters. The old V8 world has also done their share of testing as their cams/lifter experience abnormal wear without ZDDP. Modern engines have roller lifters or overhead cams so the need for ZDDP isn't there but all flat lifter engine benefit with ZDDP as that's why it was in all oils before 2001.
Yes, my point is that our VW engines need a oil with ZDDP just like they did before 2001.Go ahead and use whatever oil you want. In my own experience, my bus engine has had only one valve needing adjustment in 50,000 miles of use so far. Yes, I check them every oil change. Same thing with the 914 which has the Porsche swivel feet adjusters too.

Other cam/lifter failures I have seen were mostly of the type of mixing cams with other lifters manufacturers, mixing cams with old lifters etc....which is just sloppy work by people.
Geoff
77 Sage Green Westy- CS 2.0L-160,000 miles
70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

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