Wdollie6 Bus Thread

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by Amskeptic » Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:15 am

wdollie6 wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 6:39 am
A question, since these don't have the zerks, is there a way to grease them prior to install? Or is it even necessary?
Those are actually good joints. Installation in the arm is slightly off, yes, but within tolerance. Ball joint studs really are tough to move by hand when new, even the ez-steer ones. We won't know if these are too stiff until you have driven a couple of hundred miles.

We have to rely on the initial grease application as these are typical lubed-for-life new parts.

Colin
(p.s. I need a set, these northeast roads have damn well destroyed my car)
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by wdollie6 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:29 am

I am hopeful you are correct as I do not want to go through this process again, at least in the near future. The boots also feel fairly solid, not flimsy at all, time will tell. My goal is to get this back together tonight. Would you use the new eccentrics or the old-good ones that came off the old joints? The old ones feel more solid, if weight is any indicator.
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by asiab3 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:21 pm

I cleaned and reused the old eccentrics a few times this year; they're guaranteed to fit. (I'm convinced China is a country without micrometers.)

With both sets of those joints I installed, they were not overly tight on first drive. They were tighter than good old loose joints, but not un-drivable like some have been in the past. Moving them by hand did seem impossible, but my worries turned out to be worthless.

Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
145k miles with me.
322k miles on Earth.

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by Amskeptic » Thu Sep 06, 2018 6:35 pm

asiab3 wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:21 pm
Moving them by hand did seem impossible, but my worries turned out to be worthless.

Moving them by hand did seem impossible, but my worries turned out to be unfounded.
:cyclopsani:

(I need a set of those torsion arms)
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by wdollie6 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:12 am

Okay both sets of arms with joints installed last night, yes. Would have completed the effort however the stabilizer bar clamps frustrated me to the point of no return so got up and walked away for the evening, or damage might have occurred. And yes Colin I did purchase new, large, water pump pliers (made in the USA) to make the job easier :cherry: , they helped but... I will conquer this tonight as summer/early fall weather is departing quickly, not to mention a trip to the Berkshire's and my daughters wedding (at our house) coming up quickly.

Once the arms were installed I could move the ball joints by hand, barely, which I hope is a good sign. By the way Colin that little ol' hand crank jack (not hydraulic) that I had saved for no particular reason, handled duties just fine. Jacked up the upper torsion arm to install the rubber damper and then the lower arm to the steering knuckle (followed by the upper), both sides. Based on its performance I think I will clean this jack up and add to the onboard tool box.

I will get some pictures tonight of the assembly. Note that the only confusion I had was with the orientation of the bracket for the brake line, Bentley didn't show it clearly and I couldn't quite recall. Easy determination, removed the caliper from where it was hanging on a wire to its final position and wallah had the answer.

More to come.
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by wdollie6 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:55 am

C'mon Robbie both the boots and ball joints say Flennor & Germany, how does China come into play... :joker: :drunken:
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by asiab3 » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:08 am

We don’t know where/how well the new eccentrics are being made! The gold cad plated finish I dealt with this year reeked of an Empi catalog. Were your eccentrics stamped VW? Were the new eccentrics stamped anything?

Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
145k miles with me.
322k miles on Earth.

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by wdollie6 » Sat Sep 08, 2018 4:10 am

My attempt at humor apparently failed. These parts were most certainly not from Germany, just not sure from where. Reused the old and all is fine, except for the fact that both lower arm shock mounts have bum threads. I was able to chase the drivers side with a die, seems to be okay but the passengers side is actually missing threads at the key spot... Never even looked at this when I received them as I was focused on the quality of the Flennors. I am going to try and rechase them today but may need to go down a size, ever heard of this being done? The length of the shock mount is different as well, so had to cut the lower bushings down to match, they were over sized so had some room. I may trim them a little more to expose additional threads...

I did take the bus out for a short ride and ball joints do indeed make a difference. The good news is I do still have some return to center steering although not as much as before. We shall see how they wear in, certainly not disappointed at this point. Now will need to find an alignment shop, challenging in my area of upstate NY.
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:55 pm

wdollie6 wrote:
Sat Sep 08, 2018 4:10 am
My attempt at humor apparently failed. These parts were most certainly not from Germany, just not sure from where. Reused the old and all is fine, except for the fact that both lower arm shock mounts have bum threads. I was able to chase the drivers side with a die, seems to be okay but the passengers side is actually missing threads at the key spot... Never even looked at this when I received them as I was focused on the quality of the Flennors. I am going to try and rechase them today but may need to go down a size, ever heard of this being done? The length of the shock mount is different as well, so had to cut the lower bushings down to match, they were over sized so had some room. I may trim them a little more to expose additional threads...

I did take the bus out for a short ride and ball joints do indeed make a difference. The good news is I do still have some return to center steering although not as much as before. We shall see how they wear in, certainly not disappointed at this point. Now will need to find an alignment shop, challenging in my area of upstate NY.

Good for you! Divin in and gitner done. But geeze, really? Mangled shock mount studs? Call Midnight Auto or whoever they were and give them hell for the benefit of future customers not to mention the $50.00 credit you should get.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by asiab3 » Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:44 pm

Are you sure you didn’t receive the wrong lower torsion arms? 68-69 had smaller threads and shorter shock bushings and studs. 70+ had larger threads and wider studs. I’m about 4 for 5 in shops sending out the correct arms for my applications these last few years....

Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
145k miles with me.
322k miles on Earth.

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Sep 09, 2018 8:56 am

asiab3 wrote:
Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:44 pm
Are you sure you didn’t receive the wrong lower torsion arms? 68-69 had smaller threads and shorter shock bushings and studs. 70+ had larger threads and wider studs. I’m about 4 for 5 in shops sending out the correct arms for my applications these last few years....

Robbie

Good points. Most interested to hear a response from Midnight Parts Chuckers.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by wdollie6 » Mon Sep 10, 2018 4:35 am

They were definitely the wrong stud size and length but adapted based on that, unfortunately the threads were buggered on both sides. Drivers are fine after chasing and cutting down bushing on shock, passengers I am still working, I am going to attempt to cut down the passenger bushing a bit more as it is still a little wider than necessary, then determine if there are enough good threads to grab. If not, they go back, at least the lowers, although have not heard from Bryan at Late Night as of yet.

To compound this fun the engine now surges at cruising speed, 55 to 60, not sure the cause as of yet. Some days I wonder about this, uh, hobby...
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by Amskeptic » Mon Sep 10, 2018 4:17 pm

wdollie6 wrote:
Mon Sep 10, 2018 4:35 am

To compound this fun the engine now surges at cruising speed, 55 to 60, not sure the cause as of yet. Some days I wonder about this, uh, hobby...
Do what I did.
Go crazy.
Colin :geek:

(add 1/4 turn at each mixture screw on entire engine. Test. Report back. Give me ambient temps at above report and re-adjustment report. Be prepared to revert back)
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by wdollie6 » Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:42 am

Ambient temps at initial discovery of surging were mid 50s, will advise once adjustments complete. Just to be clear you are referring to the 2 carb adjustments along with the CIS mixture screw, correct? Also one other symptom is that the after warm up idle dropped to a point where the engine could barely keep running. I am also going to ensure that the internal filter on the fuel pump isn't gunked up, haven't checked it in a while.

Hope you found the sun and warmth you were looking for, haven't seen the sun in 5 days, flood warnings again. Now with the post-landfall hurricane turning north, ouch!
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Wdollie6 Bus Thread

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:04 pm

wdollie6 wrote:
Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:42 am
Ambient temps at initial discovery of surging were mid 50s, will advise once adjustments complete. Just to be clear you are referring to the 2 carb adjustments along with the CIS mixture screw, correct? Also one other symptom is that the after warm up idle dropped to a point where the engine could barely keep running. I am also going to ensure that the internal filter on the fuel pump isn't gunked up, haven't checked it in a while.

Hope you found the sun and warmth you were looking for, haven't seen the sun in 5 days, flood warnings again. Now with the post-landfall hurricane turning north, ouch!
Oh hold on for cripes sakes. That other symptom, what do YOU think is going on?
What would YOU check?
What symptom do you suppose you would get if the damn central idling circuit or perhaps a carb cut-off jet is suddenly not working because of a dumb loose wire or whatever?
Do NOT do my little throwaway suggestion with this IMPORTANT ADDITIONAL INFORMATION NOW ON THE TABLE. Go diagnose!
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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