µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Bus, Microbus, Transporter, Station Wagon, Vanagon, Camper, Pick-Up.

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Amskeptic
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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by Amskeptic » Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:16 pm

chewabledrapery wrote:Hi ,
hopefully I can add my own build pics/design onto another thread here if anyone is interested.
Dean.

Interested.
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BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by asiab3 » Sat Apr 16, 2016 7:16 am

Yes! Dean, welcome! And thanks for sharing such a quality first post. :) I am always interested in seeing other setups that people discover and create.
1969 bus, "Buddy."
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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by luftvagon » Sun Apr 17, 2016 5:35 pm

Hey, I just saw this... sorry about that. Congratulations, and welcome to the brighter side!!

Fuel VE is very specific to my engine, injector settings, engine configuration, etc. I can post the numbers but they will probably not work for you. Do you have full version of TunerStudioMS? I will help you build your own VE map.

Did you get my new timing map? I published SVDA equivalent timing:

Image

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic ... 6#p1226219

Please share a few pictures of your setup. I would love to get my throttle body refurbished with TPS.

In the mean time, I am switching computers to get you a sreenshots.
1981 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia - air-cooled Type4 1970cc CV (hydraulic lifters, 42x36 valves, stock cam, microSquirt FI with wasted spark ignition)
1993 Ford F-250 XL LWB Extended Cab 7.3L IDI

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by luftvagon » Sun Apr 17, 2016 6:08 pm

This is the tune, in addition to the timing posted above, I used to tow two motorcycles, two adults, and camping gear.
It is a very conservative tune I made to mimic L-Jetronic.

AFR:
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Fuel VE (16x32):
Long story short -- I wanted more detail in my fuel map. I was hunting a surge condition when going in reverse - On my previous tune I was running very lean (15.5) at high vacuum/low kPa. Was trying to know how low RPM I need to run 13.9, and when to crank it up to 15-15.5 AFR.

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Oddly enough, gas mileage was ok with 13.9 AFR. Would be great to know exact head temperature. High AFR has diminishing returns.

Ignition:
SVDA like

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1981 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia - air-cooled Type4 1970cc CV (hydraulic lifters, 42x36 valves, stock cam, microSquirt FI with wasted spark ignition)
1993 Ford F-250 XL LWB Extended Cab 7.3L IDI

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by luftvagon » Sun Apr 17, 2016 6:48 pm

Ideally, I will leave my fuel table as is, and adjust AFR with EGO control enabled. My fuel VE will act as "Open-Loop" fuel map, and once at operating temperature, I am going to use (new) AFR table to switch into "Closed-Loop" and run 16AFR starting at 3000+ RPM and 50kPa up to 75 kPa, through 5000 RPM.
1981 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia - air-cooled Type4 1970cc CV (hydraulic lifters, 42x36 valves, stock cam, microSquirt FI with wasted spark ignition)
1993 Ford F-250 XL LWB Extended Cab 7.3L IDI

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by chewabledrapery » Tue Apr 19, 2016 6:04 am

Hey luftwagon,

Thank you so much for the reply this is great, I'll punch these numbers in and see what happens, I had copied your "009" style ignition table and one of your target AFR tables so I will give the SVDA ignition table a go.

I can highly reccomend Phil Eslin for TB rebuilds I had a BMW TPS that I had acquired from a friend for free so I sent him that along with my throttle body and it came back like new, fitted for the bimmer TPS.

I do have the full version of TunerStudio so intend to do some road autotuning at some point, the only problem I have is my bus has no road tax or MOT (the british certificate of roadworthiness) as it has been off the road for over 12 months so i am in a bit of a catch 22 situation as i need to drive it on the road to tune it (which is illegal) but don't want to take it in for a test until it is mostly tuned and cannot tax it until I have an MOT.

I promise i will upload some pics and a thread based on my build to help others so please bear with me guys, I've got a lot on at the moment with work, arranging my wedding and trying to get the bus on the road for my wedding in june, oh and i moved house too and am also building myself a little workshop so it is all go at the moment!

In terms of my case/heads just a few mild additions :-

- 2.0l AMC heads with larger valves (42x36)
- European Motorworks con-rods with ARP bolts
- European Motorworks T4-C camshaft (270 Duration X .425 Lift)

Again I would really like to thank you, I wouldn't have had a clue where to start without your fantastic information and that of many other people sharing information/experiences on shoptalkforums, thesamba, msextra and various blogs.

I will do some more tweaking and report back, in the meantime here are some shiny TB pics to tease you all :)

(and a link to Phil's thesamba profile http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=173388)

Cheers,

Deano.

Image
Image
76 Bay, 2.0L Megasquirted and converted from auto to manual transmission.

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by luftvagon » Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:24 pm

Awesome! I also have 42x36 valves. I will send you my injector settings too. That should get you very close to my setup. That throttle body looks amazing. I have already sent him an email about building me one. TPS will help with acceleration enrichment and more timing control at idle.

Injector Open: 1.14
Battery Correction: 0.262

These settings came directly from digifant chip, with a bit of averaging. :) They work well with the fuel map. You can get slightly more accurate settings doing the measurements yourself, but its not worth it.
1981 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia - air-cooled Type4 1970cc CV (hydraulic lifters, 42x36 valves, stock cam, microSquirt FI with wasted spark ignition)
1993 Ford F-250 XL LWB Extended Cab 7.3L IDI

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by chewabledrapery » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:47 pm

Hey,

Brilliant thanks, I think i'm currently using your previous settings of :-

0.912 dead time
0.132 voltage correction

the one problem i seem to have is I'm wondering what "required fuel" constant you are using, i had my injectors refurbished and the datasheet that came back says they are flowing 195cc rather than the specified 205cc

Problem is if i base my required fuel on the 195 to 205 range it seems way too rich so i've manually tweaked it a bit to lean it off.

Obviously this could be due to my target AFR and VE being completely wrong and my WUE could be adding too much pulsewidth too, so many variables to play with and i'm completely new to all this :)

I think I have a spare throttle body so if you have any trouble obtaining one let me know, I guess the only problem would be the expensive shipping from UK to US but I'm happy to help out if you get stuck.

Cheers,

Deano.
76 Bay, 2.0L Megasquirted and converted from auto to manual transmission.

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by luftvagon » Thu Apr 21, 2016 5:14 am

I appreciate that. Also, I got pinged on my ReqFuel.

My reqfuel is: 7ms, running 2 squirts per cycle, and untimed injection (i dont have cam sync yet).

The reqfuel number was a result of trial and error in trying to get maximum resolution in the fuel ve.

Deano, please try the new injector numbers. I found them to be slightly better, and the fuel ve was tuned with those numbers in mind.
1981 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia - air-cooled Type4 1970cc CV (hydraulic lifters, 42x36 valves, stock cam, microSquirt FI with wasted spark ignition)
1993 Ford F-250 XL LWB Extended Cab 7.3L IDI

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by chewabledrapery » Thu Apr 21, 2016 7:25 am

luftvagon wrote:I appreciate that. Also, I got pinged on my ReqFuel.

My reqfuel is: 7ms, running 2 squirts per cycle, and untimed injection (i dont have cam sync yet).

The reqfuel number was a result of trial and error in trying to get maximum resolution in the fuel ve.

Deano, please try the new injector numbers. I found them to be slightly better, and the fuel ve was tuned with those numbers in mind.
Great,

I'll give those a new new injector numbers a go and play with the Reqfuel/squirt settings too, probably won't be for a few days as I'm currently working on my garage/workshop so that I can move my bus off the in-laws driveway, its been beached there for over a year while I've been working on this project, not only did I choose to megasquirt the engine I also changed out the auto transmission for a late 6-rib manual.

Its a good job I get along with them :)

cheers,

Deano.
76 Bay, 2.0L Megasquirted and converted from auto to manual transmission.

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by chewabledrapery » Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:40 pm

Just out of interest what is your "Injector Staging" set to?

I've just realised I had mine set to "Alternating" which had the pulse at around 13ms, changing to "Simultaneous" has now dropped the pulse to 7ms as you stated above.
76 Bay, 2.0L Megasquirted and converted from auto to manual transmission.

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by luftvagon » Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:57 pm

I am at Simultaneous Injector Staging. ReqFuel 7, and the input field below is at 3.5ms
1981 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia - air-cooled Type4 1970cc CV (hydraulic lifters, 42x36 valves, stock cam, microSquirt FI with wasted spark ignition)
1993 Ford F-250 XL LWB Extended Cab 7.3L IDI

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by chewabledrapery » Thu Apr 21, 2016 2:05 pm

luftvagon wrote:I am at Simultaneous Injector Staging. ReqFuel 7, and the input field below is at 3.5ms
Ahhhhh. Well mine was way off then I had "Alternating" with a ReqFuel of 17.0 and (ms) at 17.00!

Looking forward to trying this out, I will report back, thanks again!

:sunny:
76 Bay, 2.0L Megasquirted and converted from auto to manual transmission.

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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by chewabledrapery » Thu Apr 21, 2016 3:21 pm

Hi,

I will do a separate build post at some point but thought I'd upload a few pictures of my build just to satisfy peoples curiosity in the meantime...

Here I'm setting up the trigger wheel and sensor from thedubshop (i've actually got the wheel on back to front here as it wasn't marked and unfortunately I didn't realise until I'd re-fitted the engine and couldn't get it to start, I sorted it out though with lots of cursing!)

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Here's a view of the intake I made, in this picture you can also see the mercedes fuel evap solenoid I have used for fast cold idle...

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assembling the MS2...

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MS2 assembled...

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Here is a comparison of the old VW 1-wire cylinder head temp sensor against the BMW motorbike one I've used...

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Here I am assembling my coil driver box using 4 BIP373... (and you can see a glimpse of my "service manual" that I have written to help me build and for future reference)...

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Here is a view of my "distribution board" I have wired the MS relay board into deutsch connectors and separately fused the LC2, Crank Sensor and COP's, I designed it this way so that I could easily plug in discrete looms to aid construction and troubleshooting, it also means that if i pull the engine I can simply unplug the looms and leave them on the engine...

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Here is a view of my distribution board installed in the engine bay, you can see the looms plugged in here...

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A view from the engine bay...

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Next on my list after I've got it tuned is make a housing/mounting enclosure so that I can put the MS where the old L-jet ECU went, I did consider butchering the original housing but I can't bring myself to destroy it and I can probably make something more suitable from scratch anyway...

Enjoy, feel free to ask questions or make comments.

Cheers,

Deano.
76 Bay, 2.0L Megasquirted and converted from auto to manual transmission.

luftvagon
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Re: µSquirt ( microSquirt ) powered Vanagon ramblings

Post by luftvagon » Thu Apr 21, 2016 6:56 pm

Deano, looking great, much better than my rats nest. Do you happen to know which Mercedes the fuel evap came from? What size is the inlet, and outlet? The one I used I think is 5/16".. which would probably be sufficient if I could use timing to control idle - but I can't (no TPS). I could use about 100-150RPM more from my fast idle. This could comfortably put hot engine to 1400 RPM for few seconds on startup, and then bring her back down to 800, and then use timing advance to keep it at 975. In turn, you could get the same level of idle at cold ~1200RPM, with more fuel, and fast idle open, until engine warms up, and idle timing kicks it back down to 975RPM. Looking forward to your build thread.
1981 Volkswagen Vanagon Westfalia - air-cooled Type4 1970cc CV (hydraulic lifters, 42x36 valves, stock cam, microSquirt FI with wasted spark ignition)
1993 Ford F-250 XL LWB Extended Cab 7.3L IDI

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