Intrusion

[ruckman101]

Yes, all this government intrusion into people's private lives is just down right intolerable. Imagine, the choice of opting to buy inexpensive, inefficient, incandescent light bulbs has been stripped from us by federal law.

As evil as federally mandating who a person can marry, or whether or not to carry that rapist's child to full term. Oh...wait a minute, that's more important to the conservative's agenda than jobs.

What's next, twinkie taxes?


neal

[steve74baywin]

What we have is a criminal cartel that makes rules to keep itself in power.
We all need to recognize that they are the criminals, from there gun pointing to steal wages, stop you from trading with others, and well, I could keep typing till bedtime if I tried to list them all. It is obvious it is a criminal cartel.
Non compliance is the answer. Global non compliance. If enough people stopped complying, it would end.

Timely thread, I've been having one of those days, sitting here in disgust.

[Randy in Maine]

At least get your facts correct....although this is from Wikipedia, it is pretty accurate...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phase-out_ ... ight_bulbs

In December 2007, many of these state efforts became moot when the federal government enacted the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007, which requires all general-purpose light bulbs that produce 310–2600 lumens of light[30] be 30% more energy efficient (similar to current halogen lamps) than current incandescent bulbs by 2012 to 2014. The efficiency standards will start with 100-watt bulbs in January 2012 and end with 40-watt bulbs in January 2014.

Light bulbs outside of this range are exempt from the restrictions. Also exempt are several classes of specialty lights, including appliance lamps, rough service bulbs, 3-way, colored lamps, and plant lights.

By 2020, a second tier of restrictions would become effective, which requires all general-purpose bulbs to produce at least 45 lumens per watt (similar to current CFLs). Exemptions from the Act include reflector flood, 3-way, candelabra, colored, and other specialty bulbs.[31]


Nothing wrong with getting people to be a little more energy efficient. Those power plants they will not need to build may be actually next door to your house.

If some people were a little more protective of their other constitutional protections and actually thought a little more into the future as to what is really a better projection, we would all be better off.

[Hippie]

I have CFLs all around the house. As long as I can still get incandescents for outdoors and the garage, I'm happy.
(CFLs don't work well in subzero temperatures.)

I do wish, however, that the government would spend some time destroying corporate conspiracies, rather than piddling around with light bulbs and flag burning laws.

[ruckman101]

Randy has busted me for oversimplifying the issue to elicit maximum emotional impact in an attempt at ironic sarcasm.

I was trying to point out the hypocrisy I see from the "less government" crowd. Tea party affiliated legislators rallied the cry over the light bulbs. And while "more jobs" is the mantra, efforts seem to be concentrated on social issues, attempting to intrude one's own morals onto others by law.


neal

[ruckman101]

Here's a frightening graph.

http://cr4re.com/charts/charts.html#cat ... ne2011.jpg



neal

[Hippie]

Here's a frightening graph.

http://cr4re.com/charts/charts.html#cat ... ne2011.jpg



neal

No surprise. We all saw this mess coming unless we were not paying the slightest attention.
You can't do business like in the 1920s without following that with the 1930s type depression. Like, duh, right?

[hambone]

Too many eclairs go right to the ass. Oh those metaphorical fatasses, waiting to burst on money stolen from cancer children unable to afford care. Life on Earth gives us the ability to caress or crush, decide and act, then view the results. It's a big spiritual chemistry lab.

[hippiewannabe]

Yes, all this government intrusion into people's private lives is just down right intolerable. Imagine, the choice of opting to buy inexpensive, inefficient, incandescent light bulbs has been stripped from us by federal law.

As evil as federally mandating who a person can marry, or whether or not to carry that rapist's child to full term. Oh...wait a minute, that's more important to the conservative's agenda than jobs.

What's next, twinkie taxes?


neal

The problem is forcing people to do by law what they wouldn't choose to do by simple economic choice. If there are externalities to the consumption of electricity that aren't properly included in its price, such as global warming and mountain top removal, put them in through a tax. Let electricity costs reflect all relevant factors, and let people choose if the warm glow of incandescent is worth the cost over cold compact fluorescent.

[Lanval]

Yes, all this government intrusion into people's private lives is just down right intolerable. Imagine, the choice of opting to buy inexpensive, inefficient, incandescent light bulbs has been stripped from us by federal law.

As evil as federally mandating who a person can marry, or whether or not to carry that rapist's child to full term. Oh...wait a minute, that's more important to the conservative's agenda than jobs.

What's next, twinkie taxes?


neal

The problem is forcing people to do by law what they wouldn't choose to do by simple economic choice. If there are externalities to the consumption of electricity that aren't properly included in its price, such as global warming and mountain top removal, put them in through a tax. Let electricity costs reflect all relevant factors, and let people choose if the warm glow of incandescent is worth the cost over cold compact fluorescent.

Why should people be allowed to destroy the world simply because they're willing to bear the cost of the destruction of all our tomorrows?

MIke

[steve74baywin]

The problem is forcing people to do by law what they wouldn't choose to do by simple economic choice. If there are externalities to the consumption of electricity that aren't properly included in its price, such as global warming and mountain top removal, put them in through a tax. Let electricity costs reflect all relevant factors, and let people choose if the warm glow of incandescent is worth the cost over cold compact fluorescent.

Very true, I more than most dislike such a thing, as I stated earlier it is the criminal cartel making rules, yet I have been using the compact fluorescent bulbs longer than anyone I know. In this dwelling and the last, every bulb was a fluorescent for the last 10 years, and many of the main ones for the few years before that. Now some would say doing that should be against the law, you know, with all the mercury.
Big lesson to learn, no one, or group of people can KNOW all, so to start making laws to do it certain way, then later arrest people who do it the opposite way, sounds like a bunch of anal control freaks. Some people speak as if things are unchangeable facts, wondering why someone should be allowed to destroy the planet, sounds like something from a cartoon.

[Randy in Maine]

The amount of mercury in a CFL or even in a modern fluro bulb is miniscule (compared to us playing with mercury in chemistry class in high school) and there is no exposre unless it breaks. Here those dead ones are collected at about everywhere as the intent of doing so is to keep Hg out of the environment. Keeping Hg out of the environment is why those utilities who burn coal are crying now as it contains a small amount of Hg as a contaminant in coal.

I did not write this, but it is informative....even though it is a few years old.

http://www.maine.gov/dep/rwm/homeowner/cflreport.htm

No body is going to get arrested, shot or hung in my lifetime for using or buying incandesent bulbs. They already cannot be sold in most of the world, so few companies would be willing to make them for those that might just be sold here. They are going away anyway as they are about 1% light and 99% heat.

People made the same claims when they quit putting cocaine in Coke, took the lead out of gas, made doctors get licensed, etc.

If those who are that concerned about it could put half of their effort to good instead of evil, we would all be better off.

[Amskeptic]

Neal's point is beautiful. Those who are crying about this country's (via government regulation of course) attempt to move us towards more efficiency as some unforgiveable assault against our freedom, are strangely silent when it comes to the overreach of regulating intimate personal decisions like who marrys who and the need to terminate a pregnancy for personal/medical reasons quite beyond the scope of the United States Congress. This is a rich irony.

We regulate the quantity of water used to flush our toilets. Where is the hue and cry?
Why do we push back against efficiency? It serves . . . US.
Colin

[steve74baywin]

Neal's point is beautiful. Those who are crying about this country's (via government regulation of course) attempt to move us towards more efficiency as some unforgiveable assault against our freedom, are strangely silent when it comes to the overreach of regulating intimate personal decisions like who marrys who and the need to terminate a pregnancy for personal/medical reasons quite beyond the scope of the United States Congress. This is a rich irony.
We regulate the quantity of water used to flush our toilets. Where is the hue and cry?
Why do we push back against efficiency? It serves . . . US.
Colin

Only if you close your ears to the truth are they strangely silent Colin. I am not silent, or do you want me to speak up on here a whole lot more than I do?
What you point out is the smoke and mirror portion the main stream wants you to focus on.

Neal's point is towards the media prompted up example of a Tea Partier, which is just another distraction, that I predicted almost two years ago would be. Lies as usual by those who deceive the people into giving the gov more power than it should have. Don't get fooled again. Wasn't getting fooled by Obama enough?
This is exactly the sort of things you get when you stray from the limited government principles. There would be no regulating of marriage. But, if you give the gov power to do things it should not have power to do, next thing you know, your able to make comments like the above. When I have asked the gays that care about marriage what the beef is, they say it is because they can't be a spouse on their lovers medical coverage or Social Security.
The first problem is marriage shouldn't be licensed by the gov. That is the first problem, collectivist, those giving the gov more power than it ever should of had, look to the gov to sanction their relationships. Then, the same collectivist allow their money to be stolen from them by the gov. This would not be an issue if we had the correct gov. There wouldn't be a state or government permit or license for marriage. There wouldn't be money forced from you that then you had to fight to get back. There could be private insurance, and if one company offered no insurance, and one offered some with no add on beneficiary, and one did, you could choose which one if any of the three you wanted to give your money to.
This is so odd, funny, whatever you want to call it. The people who want the gov to control almost everything, does not see that is the problem, that they want and have let the gov control too much. It is the cause of this constant bickering.

This is an example of a wrong, on top of wrong, and then another wrong.

I really am surprised that some on here can't see this.

[steve74baywin]

If those who are that concerned about it could put half of their effort to good instead of evil, we would all be better off.

What if I, looking for more ways to survive, I start making incandescent bulbs for those who want them. (no evil yet)
I sell them to people who still want them in Florida, and then maybe some people in Georgia.
So far I see nothing evil.
I wonder if any group of people would try to stop me?
I could see some from the gov showing up, pushing their force around with guns to stop me from doing this. (Evil now present) Imagine that, I am just making bulbs for a few people who want them. Then some group of men, with weapons to kill, show up and use violence to force me to stop. (evil) These men are paid money from a gov that uses guns and force (evil) to get it from people.