Huh

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MeyerII
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Huh

Post by MeyerII » Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:46 am

Back in my day, this 'Free Speech' section was a hell of a lot more lively.

What happened?

https://youtu.be/_o8gxFGAh9w
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JLT
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Re: Huh

Post by JLT » Fri Apr 29, 2016 8:13 pm

MeyerII wrote:Back in my day, this 'Free Speech' section was a hell of a lot more lively.

What happened?

https://youtu.be/_o8gxFGAh9w
I dunno. More people getting their rants done on Facebook now? A general aging of the AIC population?

As for me, I still put in a comment now and then in a political thread, but not as a habit. I've learned that as reasoned and concise as my arguments are, nobody gives much of a durn. So I prefer to listen rather than talk.
-- JLT
Sacramento CA

Present bus: '71 Dormobile Westie "George"
(sometimes towing a '65 Allstate single-wheel trailer)
Former buses: '61 17-window Deluxe "Pink Bus"
'70 Frankenwestie "Blunder Bus"
'71 Frankenwestie "Thunder Bus"

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Amskeptic
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Re: Huh

Post by Amskeptic » Sun May 08, 2016 6:11 am

MeyerII wrote:Back in my day, this 'Free Speech' section was a hell of a lot more lively.

What happened?
a) We have lost the novelty of an online community.
Same thing happened at theSamba where their infamous Rants was finally shut down. Now we are all more focused.

b) I have personally offended thousands upon thousands of people here in Free Speech, who then complained to their five friends who then passed it on to three of their friends, and this adds up.

c) The attrition of air-cooled Volkswagens continues . . . many of our members have moved on. :cyclopsani:
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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Mr Blotto
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Re: Huh

Post by Mr Blotto » Mon May 09, 2016 7:33 pm

It is all Turk's fault! :joker: :joker: :joker: :joker:
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dingo
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Re: Huh

Post by dingo » Tue May 10, 2016 11:24 am

Debate devolves quickly into divisiveness and polarization as the dumptrucks back up noisily with mountains of evidence, proof, and 'truth'. Good discussion that progresses forward is more delicate, ego-free...and requires many deep breaths to keep it positively motivated
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Amskeptic
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Re: Huh

Post by Amskeptic » Thu May 12, 2016 6:24 am

dingo wrote:Debate devolves quickly into divisiveness and polarization as the dumptrucks back up noisily with mountains of evidence, proof, and 'truth'. Good discussion that progresses forward is more delicate, ego-free...and requires many deep breaths to keep it positively motivated
This is merely the continuing *evolution* of public involvement. If you look at discussions in the 60's and before, they occurred mostly in the elite circles of academia or executive suites. Your average American could only go so far as the local paper and three channels on TV.

Now we all feel like we can participate in the internet-driven age that has knocked the elites off their pedestals and it is messy and raucous and stupid and our media reflects it back at us, populism has overrun the august corridors of power. Eventually things will either settle down straighten up or go to hell.
Colin :cyclopsani:
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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JLT
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Re: Huh

Post by JLT » Thu May 12, 2016 8:59 am

Amskeptic wrote: Eventually things will either settle down straighten up or go to hell.
Colin :cyclopsani:
I guess we'll find out in November.
-- JLT
Sacramento CA

Present bus: '71 Dormobile Westie "George"
(sometimes towing a '65 Allstate single-wheel trailer)
Former buses: '61 17-window Deluxe "Pink Bus"
'70 Frankenwestie "Blunder Bus"
'71 Frankenwestie "Thunder Bus"

Lanval
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Re: Huh

Post by Lanval » Thu May 26, 2016 4:27 pm

dingo wrote:Debate devolves quickly into divisiveness and polarization as the dumptrucks back up noisily with mountains of evidence, proof, and 'truth'. Good discussion that progresses forward is more delicate, ego-free...and requires many deep breaths to keep it positively motivated
True debate requires a willingness that both sides do two (at a minimum) things:

1. Treat the other side's arguments with respect
2. Agree on some basic aspects of the argument (i.e. definitions, actions, etc.)

If 2 is missing, then debate does not exist. It's merely telling someone what you believe is inviolable, then being aggrieved when they don't see the "truth". Most people operate as if belief (a reasoned outcome based on theory and experience) in politics, economics, whatever is the same as BELIEF (an acceptance of a way of thinking which cannot be either reasoned or proven) in religion. There is room for both, but too often, they are conflated, with a loss of community, respect and a shared sense of "we're all in this together" as a result,

Would that people focused as strongly on what makes as similar, as they do on what makes us different...

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JLT
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Re: Huh

Post by JLT » Thu May 26, 2016 4:41 pm

Lanval wrote:
dingo wrote: True debate requires a willingness that both sides do two (at a minimum) things:

1. Treat the other side's arguments with respect
2. Agree on some basic aspects of the argument (i.e. definitions, actions, etc.)

If 2 is missing, then debate does not exist.

<snip>

Would that people focused as strongly on what makes as similar, as they do on what makes us different...
Much truth in that! Thanks for posting.
-- JLT
Sacramento CA

Present bus: '71 Dormobile Westie "George"
(sometimes towing a '65 Allstate single-wheel trailer)
Former buses: '61 17-window Deluxe "Pink Bus"
'70 Frankenwestie "Blunder Bus"
'71 Frankenwestie "Thunder Bus"

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Amskeptic
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Re: Huh

Post by Amskeptic » Sun May 29, 2016 6:07 am

Lanval wrote:
dingo wrote:Debate devolves quickly into divisiveness and polarization as the dumptrucks back up noisily with mountains of evidence, proof, and 'truth'. Good discussion that progresses forward is more delicate, ego-free...and requires many deep breaths to keep it positively motivated
True debate requires a willingness that both sides do two (at a minimum) things:

1. Treat the other side's arguments with respect
2. Agree on some basic aspects of the argument (i.e. definitions, actions, etc.)

If 2 is missing, then debate does not exist. It's merely telling someone what you believe is inviolable, then being aggrieved when they don't see the "truth". Most people operate as if belief (a reasoned outcome based on theory and experience) in politics, economics, whatever is the same as BELIEF (an acceptance of a way of thinking which cannot be either reasoned or proven) in religion. There is room for both, but too often, they are conflated, with a loss of community, respect and a shared sense of "we're all in this together" as a result,

Would that people focused as strongly on what makes as similar, as they do on what makes us different...
Lanval!
Good to see you.
What an amazing time we are in.
This election season . . . I call "Chickens Are Coming Home To Roost" time.
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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satchmo
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Re: Huh

Post by satchmo » Sun May 29, 2016 10:40 am

Lanval wrote:and a shared sense of "we're all in this together" as a result,
Unfortunately (at least in my opinion), there are a great many people who do not subscribe to the WITT philosophy ("We're In This Together") Instead, they operate on the YOYO principle ("You're On Your Own"). It is hard to debate almost anything when ones' underlying view of the world differs so radically and there is no shared sense of what it means to be an American, or human for that matter.

Satchmo (gotta use this now that there is another Tim on the IAC)
By three methods we may learn wisdom:
First, by reflection, which is noblest;
second, by immitation, which is easiest;
and third, by experience, which is bitterest. -Confucius

MonoCone
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Re: Huh

Post by MonoCone » Thu Jun 02, 2016 10:22 am

I am also back from a long hiatus. Way back in time this forum was a hotbed of opinions raging at the state of affairs.
Looking things over I like the current vibe much better.
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Amskeptic
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Re: Huh

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:06 am

MonoCone wrote:I am also back from a long hiatus. Way back in time this forum was a hotbed of opinions raging at the state of affairs.
Looking things over I like the current vibe much better.

I am still raging at the state of defective parts, but the political world I have distilled in my own mind down to an argumentative family. Whereas I used to participate with my own argumentative family, I now observe with detached bemusement. Likewise with politics.

This last week I have had an interesting series of conversations with the Old White Men of Wyoming and South Dakota, sometimes within earshot of Fox News blaring in the background. What used to inflame my passions now piques my curiosity, how did these guys arrive at their perspectives, how deeply do they hold them, how much of their banter is just bonding with their friends? Is this country being driven by voters who do not really think about the issues and just want to be identified with the winning team in their circle of people?
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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dingo
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Re: Huh

Post by dingo » Tue Jul 05, 2016 10:35 am

Yeah, i too, find it interesting to examine why people hold so tightlly to their allegiance to certain ideas, or narratives...they seem to be largely based on emotional needs; security, approval, acceptance...to stand out naked with ones real opinions or real confusion or real fears, is er quite uncomfortable...and most will just rather hide within the narrative of the herd...
'71 Kombi, 1600 dp

';78 Tranzporter 2L

" Fill what's empty, empty what's full, and scratch where it itches."

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SlowLane
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Re: Huh

Post by SlowLane » Tue Jul 05, 2016 8:12 pm

MonoCone wrote:Way back in time this forum was a hotbed of opinions raging at the state of affairs.
Looking things over I like the current vibe much better.
Elvis (no, the other Elvis) put it best: "I used to be disgusted, now I'm just amused."
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"Wisdom comes from experience. Experience is often a result of lack of wisdom."
- Terry Pratchett

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