really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

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TrollFromDownBelow
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really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Tue Mar 17, 2015 7:15 pm

There is absolutely nothing in the free speech forum about Netanyahu's address to congress, or the election in Israel, or the republican's letter to Iran about the on going negotiations? really are we that focused on this forum to domestic affairs? These are big issues folks....no one has an opinion?
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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by hippiewannabe » Tue Mar 24, 2015 8:16 pm

You first!
When thousands of people believe a made-up story for a month, we call it fake news. When a billion people believe a made-up story for a thousand years, we call it a religion.

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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Tue Mar 24, 2015 9:49 pm

A lot has transpired in the last week.... obviously Netenyahu was reelected. I used to think there was some code of ethics of how things played out in the public arena of politics, but Netenyahu 's address to congress and his recent statements, he's obviously assuming a that 2016 elections will result in an electorate that is much more favorable to his way of thinking. okay....we don't have control over on other countries heads of state, so no real comment on that, other than world politics have hit an all time low .... really? we're supposed to be best of buds with Israel, and they are thumbing their nose at us? Couldn't wait 2 years? Have to take the fight public? not impressed.

I think the Republican's letter to Iraq was way out of line ...we can have our squabbles internally, but we don't air our dirty laundry. we need to present one front to the rest of the world. period.

next...
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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by Lanval » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:25 pm

TrollFromDownBelow wrote:....we don't have control over on other countries heads of state, so no real comment on that, other than world politics have hit an all time low ....
I don't think it's as bad as all that; consider the situation today with 100 years ago... I would think that March 1915 pretty well puts our current state of affairs in a rather bright light, don't you think? Need I point out that on April 22, 1915, Chlorine gas was used on the Western Front for the first time?

Prof. Earl, who at the time was a tenured prof. at the U of O, and who specialized medieval, particularly Anglo-Saxon poetry, once began a lecture on Beowulf in which he argued that, "No matter where we look in the long history of man, everyone who has ever bothered to speak of such things has said: 'There was a time when men were heroes and women were models of feminine virtue, but now the world has fallen away to evil and sin.'"

And it is true. The opening of Beowulf itself is an extended meditation on a great king from past years (that section ends with the line "that was good kinging!") before it introduces us to Hrothgar, ineffectual king of the Danes who cannot protect his people from the evils of the outside world.

The good old days are today; imperfect? Sure. Is corruption and injustice too common? It is, but consider how much more secret and unknown were those things in the past. Much of our worst news is not new, only newly spoken... and what we bring to light and expose, we can change.

I don't like what's happening in the Middle East, but I won't pretend that it's the worst civilization has to offer; things have been much, much worse, and I trust we will not return there. Here's hoping.

ML

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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Mar 29, 2015 9:13 am

Lanval wrote: The good old days are today; imperfect? Sure. Is corruption and injustice too common? It is, but consider how much more secret and unknown were those things in the past. Much of our worst news is not new, only newly spoken... and what we bring to light and expose, we can change.

I don't like what's happening in the Middle East, but I won't pretend that it's the worst civilization has to offer; things have been much, much worse, and I trust we will not return there. Here's hoping.

ML
I am a "positivist." I believe there is a sum-totalling of our knowledge and experience. With the perspective of this slow accumulation of experience and knowledge of human history, and with an awareness that there is far to go, I thought the Republicans' letter to Iran was a pretty amazing act of idiocy that was gorgeously and gracefully responded to by Iran's foreign minister, Mohammad Javad Zarif, who pretty much schooled those idiots on our own Constitution. I can't get breathless about it and declare treason! but it was pathetic.

Netanyahu and republican congresspersons are just the latest fake friends as we have seen with Donald Rumsfeld and Saddam Hussein, Ronald Reagan and Ayatollah Khomeini, George Bush and his soul mate Vladimir Putin, fake friendships that turn on a political dime.
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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by 72Hardtop » Tue Apr 07, 2015 6:42 am

Amskeptic wrote:
Lanval wrote: The good old days are today; imperfect? Sure. Is corruption and injustice too common? It is, but consider how much more secret and unknown were those things in the past. Much of our worst news is not new, only newly spoken... and what we bring to light and expose, we can change.

I don't like what's happening in the Middle East, but I won't pretend that it's the worst civilization has to offer; things have been much, much worse, and I trust we will not return there. Here's hoping.

ML
I am a "positivist." I believe there is a sum-totalling of our knowledge and experience. With the perspective of this slow accumulation of experience and knowledge of human history, and with an awareness that there is far to go, I thought the Republicans' letter to Iran was a pretty amazing act of idiocy that was gorgeously and gracefully responded to by Iran's foreign minister, Mohammad Javad Zarif, who pretty much schooled those idiots on our own Constitution. I can't get breathless about it and declare treason! but it was pathetic.

Netanyahu and republican congresspersons are just the latest fake friends as we have seen with Donald Rumsfeld and Saddam Hussein, Ronald Reagan and Ayatollah Khomeini, George Bush and his soul mate Vladimir Putin, fake friendships that turn on a political dime.
Colin
You left out the juicy part where Mohammad Javad Zarif ended his speech with...Death to Israel and America. He does this with every speech.
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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Apr 21, 2015 7:49 am

72Hardtop wrote: You left out the juicy part where Mohammad Javad Zarif ended his speech with...Death to Israel and America. He does this with every speech.
You left out the part where colloquial speech must be considered.

Remember John McCain? "“bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran” ??


Rick Steves from a TED talk about his time in Iran:
"Fear is for people who don't get out much. Bombast hogs the headlines, skewing understanding between the mainstream in each country. I try to make sense of the fearmongering and billboard hate, which mixes with huge smiles and welcomes. People greet me with a smile. Invariably, they ask where I’m from. I often say, 'You tell me.' They guess and guess, running through 9–10 countries before giving up. Finally I say 'America' and they are momentarily shocked, thinking, 'I thought Americans hate us. Why would one be here like this?' Their smile leaves their face. Then a bigger smile comes back as they say 'Welcome!' or 'I love America.'
In a hundred such interactions in ten days in Iran, never once has my saying 'I am an American' resulted in anything less than a smile or a kind of 'Ohhh, you are rich and strong,' or 'People and people together no problem, but I don’t like your president.' It’s clear to me that Iranians like our president as much as Americans like Iran’s.

As we were struggling to drive away in a horribly congested street, our guide made a telling aside. He declared, 'Death to traffic.' Then he said, 'Because we can do nothing about this traffic, we can all say ‘Death to Traffic’.' Did he mean kill all those drivers that were in our way? Does Iran really mean death to the US and Israel? Or is it a mix of international road rage, fear, frustration — and the seductive clarity of a catchy slogan? This quirky cultural trait might be worth looking into and trying to understand.
All I’ve got to say is, “Death to hatred and militarism based on misunderstanding, fear and national pride.”
Now you, 72Hardtop, have a choice. You can read the above and let understanding fill your mind, or not.
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BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by 72Hardtop » Fri Apr 24, 2015 9:23 pm

Rather than take it from someone who visited take it from someone who grew up there. I had a former partner who immigrated (born & raised) from Iran and he will tell you first hand of the horrors that run amuck in that country. Ted is doing nothing more than using satire out of a brief visit to Iran...hardly enough to take seriously.
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Re: really? do we have our heads buried in the sand?

Post by Amskeptic » Thu Apr 30, 2015 8:32 am

72Hardtop wrote:Rather than take it from someone who visited take it from someone who grew up there. I had a former partner who immigrated (born & raised) from Iran and he will tell you first hand of the horrors that run amuck in that country. Ted is doing nothing more than using satire out of a brief visit to Iran...hardly enough to take seriously.
You have a choice. You can HEAR the message I just shared with you, or you can remain huddled with the sole anecdote of your partner who grew up there. Of course that culture can be a terrible experience for some people, but then again, would you think it fair for a inner city disenfranchised Detroit resident to be the sole representative of life in America?

So this guy, RICK STEVES, who gave a TED talk, is a well-known author and host of a television series, why would I NOT confer legitimacy on his observations? "Hardly enough to take seriously?"

Why would I "rather" close my mind to the bitter experiences of your former partner, which I can appreciate on an individual level, sure, but I surely am not going to close my mind to the rest of the information I have, no way. Iran has "an eclectic cultural elasticity has been said to be one of the key defining characteristics of the Persian spirit and a clue to its historical longevity" it is one of the great civilizations of human existence. And I think Rick Steves was able to perceive warmth and hospitality because his mind was open.
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

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